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I’ve recently received 250mg of 5-Meo-MiPT. I was able to get the solubility of the 5-Meo-MiPT in PG and that should work fine but the people doing that were using it for oral volumetric dosing or shelf life.
My question is can I use a normal vaporizer to vape my PG solution effectively. My vape is able to control temperature generally. Any and all info you guys have related to this topic would be much appreciated including links to other threads
Generally not a good idea to vape HCL’s or Fumarate salts, nasty stuff. You want to convert that to a freebase then look at vape.
If it’s suspended in PG I would imagine the way it vaporises would be different considering its not combustion. I have no clue though it just seems reasonable. Still probably gonna try it anyway it’s not something I plan to do in excess. Do appreciate the input though!
It depends on how close the vaporization temps are to one another, and how soluble the drug is in the PG. The more disparate the vaporization temps, the more likely you’ll get closer and closer to deposition of the drug and only vape PG. The same effect happens with low solubility. The less soluble, the more likely the drug will deposit and not vaporize much, and as the amount of your solvent decreases (PG in this case) it’s more likely to crash out.
Freebases are always going to have a lower vaporization temp, which is better for your lungs anyway.
Thanks for the in-depth explanation! The solubility is quite high from what I’ve read, it dissolves easily in slightly warm PG from quite a few individual accounts. And since to vaporize it requires more heat I doubt it will crash out of solution as you described. I could be completely wrong but I feel it’s an experiment worthy of my time!
I also find the freebase process usually not worth my time even for just singular dose batches. I always fail no matter how much I change the baking soda ratios and no matter how patient I am with heat it never seems to work! If you’ve got any easier ways to free base with out a darn spoon and lighter id be happy to hear them
Doesn’t sound to complicated reminds me of the last few steps too freebase dmt except with a different solvent. Only issue is pure ammonium hydroxide and diethyl ether are highly regulated in Canada I can buy like 30mls of ether for like 70 dollars lmao.
Definitely jealous of your lab situation even beakers and scientific grade glass is regulated in Canada it’s such bs. Again thanks for the in-depth explanation it’s appreciated and helps my understanding of the topic grow
When I made a free base of 4homcpt, I use sodium bicarbonate, and turned it into sodium carbonate. Than I dissolved it in water, at the highest amount that would dissolve in water making a basic solution, than adding in the 4homcpt while stirring it in. I used a mason jar, and had it in a pot of water so I could gently heat it to help it break down, after a few minutes of stirring, I put the jar in the freezer and once the freebase had came out of the water, I just filtered and saved what was in the coffee filter. I used a tek that was for dmt, but I didn’t think sodium bicarbonate was working as good and making carbonate seemed to help.
For a spoon, just do it like a crack tek. Put in the water, the chem, sprinkle around 1/4th of the weight of the chem, for the soda, and gently heat it, you may not even have too. But use a candle if you want too, and move it over the flame to where the fluid is spinning a little, mixing it good, and don’t let it boil. After around a minute of mixing everything and it being heated, sprinkle in some drops of cool water and let it sit for a minute, or get in the freezer or something. I’d even just dumped the water on a plate and let it dry and scrape up the rocks or oil instead of using a filter and catching it.
It’s okay to use extra baking soda, it’s not going to harm much except make it taste worst, it’s better to use too much than not enough for a lot of salt drugs, like coke. I’d rather make a heavily soda rock that I can recook or just deal with the shit taste than load up a bunch of coke salt and just waste it.
There’s a bunch of different ways of making freebases. But I prefer doing it in the jar, and just getting the water at the max solubility point with sodium carbonate and adding the chems from there. Just easy mixing and filtering for the most part.
I am not an expert here, so I will give what I believe to be correct. When vaping chemicals the free base has a much much lower temp at which it turns to liquid and starts to vape or evaporate off. If the chem is not in freebase form I don’t believe that mixing it with PG changes the form its in, ie does not make it a freebase. Which means you still have to heat your PG solution to a temp where the salt melts to a liquid and evaporates off to get the goodies out.
The concern with vaping salts is that the decomposition temperature is lower than the vaporization temperature. If this is the case then with an HCl salt you will be inhaling HCl gas which in small amounts you may not notice the damage but chronic exposure can cause COPD and other damage to your lungs.
Note certain chemicals like methamphetamine HCl do not have this problem because the decomposition. Temperature is higher than the vaporization temperature.
If you’re planning on vaporizing a salt then its prudent for your own safety to compare these temperatures or lacking such information freebase the chemical first.
I mean the first 2 things that pop into my head for safe salts to vape would be methamphetamine and nicotine. I think meth is usually HCl not sure about nicotine.
I was also under the impression PCE analogues are safe to vape as salts.
Not sure if it’s “safe” as in non-toxic (but still bad for the lungs due to temperature) just never heard the concept of vaping salts being an across the board bad idea and since plenty of chems get vaped not as a freebase without apparent problems I was curious what the concern is.
Especially with chemicals that are only used sparingly
again, I’m no expert, I cant say why these are “ok” to vape or smoke in a salt form. I’ll look into it now that you brought it up, its def interesting enough to look into.
If i had to make an uneducated guess it would be the salt used, maybe some are less harmful than others? However in the case of HCL, there has to be a reason crackheads convert to FB before smoking it. Or maybe methheads dont care about their health enough to convert it???
I thought it was just about temp. I think cocaine.HCl has a boiling point too high to vape vs the much lower temperature of freebase (I’m guessing since this is how it works with nicotine).
So if the vaping temperature of say methamphetamine, pyrrolidines, or nicotine salts are low enough than maybe they vape ok and not worth the hassle.
I only say all this because there are lots of reports of vaping Moxy as a salt and the consensus seems to be that freebase is more efficient but the salt is still possible. Freebasing sounds like a royal pain in the ass (hence why I haven’t bothered with the PCP analogues despite being very curious how that ROA is)
Freebasing is a more efficient method of self-administering alkaloids via the smoking route. For example, cocaine hydrochloride decomposes at the high temperatures necessary for smoking. Free base cocaine, in which the cocaine alkaloid is “freed” from the hydrochloride salt, has a melting point of 98 ℃ and is volatile at temperatures above 90 ℃, therefore providing an active drug for smoking. After inhalation the alkaloid is absorbed into the blood stream and rapidly transported throughout the body. However, since blood is buffered with carbonate at physiological pH (near 7.4), free-base amines will be rapidly converted back into their acid form. In fact, 94.19% of cocaine will exist as the acid form under equilibrium at pH=7.4, calculated using the Henderson-Hasselbalch equation[better source needed] assuming a pKa of 8.61. A small portion (5.81%) of cocaine will remain as free-base and pass through the blood-brain barrier; according to Le Chatelier’s principle[better source needed] the acid form of cocaine will be continually converted to free-base as the base form is continually removed across the blood-brain barrier.
I found it interesting anyway.
Oh hey, sorry I didn’t notice the user switch there. I thought I had the guy I replied to, my bad. Not sure if you noticed there is a Canadian vendor selling 5-meo-mipt in freebase form. No mess or hassle in converting, it just comes down to getting the concentration right for your vape, and vape habits.
Personally when I got some free base 5-meo-malt, I dissolved it in 99% alcohol and sprayed some leaf with a known amount of material in it. very accurate because you are using volumetric measuring.
That’s exactly what I was wondering thanks!
I wish there was more unified documentation about RCs and less common drugs with their melting points, salt forms, and how to freebase as well as the freebase melting points.
Would be so useful for anyone curious to try a different ROA, and with electric vaporizers becoming much more common I’d imagine more people would be open to it vs the foil and meth pipe days.
I have seen absolutely no evidence that there is reason to be seriously worried about vaping fumarate salts. Even the person who kinda started this rumor has addressed the panic that’s spread around it, saying people are vastly overstating the hypothetical danger he was talking about.
The amount of irritant that would be released from >100mg of material would be absolutely tiny, and the cases of poisoning all involve industrial exposure.
I have seen no reports of reactions from vaping fumarates, there are no reported hospitalizations, no anything.
Yes, but maleic anhydride is not botulinium toxins. We know what it is and what its effects are and they are mainly as an irritant. It is generally regarded as a safe chemical, and beyond the potential for causing acute irritation and the potential for repeated exposure to cause an allergic response (which we have not heard reports of yet from vaporized or even conbusted fumarate salts) I haven’t see anything about it being a suspected carcinogen or causing more serious harm.
Actually, I smoked the HCl with weed and it tasted very sweet like candy. It didn’t feel toxic, and it was exactly the same as oral ROA, maybe a little weaker. I think you have to freebase to get a faster comeup.